Author Topic: Dota6.9 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions  (Read 17271 times)

Offline mordor911

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Last update with giving !pub to dota7 is done in favor for about 1/3 of community population. Dota6.9 map has over 65% games and Dota7 map less than 35%. Lagabuse favoritism to Dota7 is giving advantage and making it harder for Dota6.9 when creating the game. Example is making game remake and missing to use huge L so it is hosted Dota7 which mean Host need to unhost and create the game again while losing players. Dota6.9 and Dota7 is not the same game, Dota7 is like Dota2, while Dota6.9 is classic dota1 game and the only same thing used in both are heroes and building names, neutrals names, skills names and similar stuff.

Few ideas to solve this for next/new season:
1. Separate completely Dota6.9 and Dota7 - separate Ladder, let bot to calculate stats in one database for Dota6.9 and in second for Dota2
2. Like it is done with custom maps, make for Dota6.9 and Dota2 separated channels and separated league.
In past it was PD.eu , then Lagabuse.com and now is la-dota, make lagabuse.com or just /w lagabuse for 1 game and la-dota for another. Custom games can have /w custom or /w customgame.
Legacy is usually used for low movies and tv shows, bad new games/remaster and similar. Dota6.9 is not a bad game and 6.9 is the best dota1 version ever created so far and it is offensive for game to get down to the list while its better and favored by majority of players. Administration took too seriously activities from trash talkers about how Dota7 is more popular with which statistics definitely will not agree with.
We are all equal as players, if all above is not possible then give to Dota6.9 !pubc (classic) or !pubo (old) and to Dota7 !pubn (new) or !pub7.
When using !lobbies command or when entering to check all games it is always 3-4 Dota1 6.9map and 1-max2 Dota7 7.0map. Dota 7 have more games only in late night/early morning period after 02h. Entire day is reserved for majority of Dota1 6.9 map players.

Now Statistics, it is important to mention how many players do not know how to host and this switch and unfair favoritism bring only confusion to players and most from that group like more classic dota1 6.9 map.

Each day ends in early morning when last games are played.

- Before !pub switch, screenshots not taken:
Dota6.9 games played just before switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 150 games:
18/30
19/30
17/30
17/30
25/30

18+19+17+17+28 = 96/150 Dota1 games and 54/150 Dota7 games


- Day1:

Dota6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 150 games. Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
21/30     Draws:  3/1
18/30                 1/1
19/30                 3/2
18/30                 1/2
19/30                 3/0

Draws: Dota6.9 = 11 draws and Dota7 = 6 draws
21+18+19+18+19 = 95/150 Dota6.9 games and 55/150 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 95 - 11 = 84 games
Dota7 - draw = 55 - 6 = 49 games














- Day2 part1:

Dota6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 4 pages 120 games. Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
13/26     Draws:  1/3
18/30                 4/6
17/30                 0/2
19/30                 4/2

Draws: Dota6.9 = 9 draws and Dota7 = 13 draws
13+18+17+19= 67/120 Dota6.9 games and 53/120 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 67 - 9 = 58 games
Dota7 - draw = 53 - 13 = 40 games


Spoiler for Hiden:









- Day2 part2:

Dota6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 3 pages 77 games. Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
10/17     Draws:  1/0
16/30                 0/3
16/30                 1/0

Draws: Dota6.9 = 2 draws and Dota7 = 3 draws
10+16+16=42/77 Dota6.9 games and 35/77 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 42 - 2 = 40 games
Dota7 - draw = 35 - 3 = 32 games


Spoiler for Hiden:







- Day3:

Dota6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 140 games.  Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
18/30     Draws: 0/1
17/30                 1/1
19/30                 1/1
14/30                 0/2
11/20                 1/3

Draws: Dota6.9 = 3 draws and Dota7 = 8 draws
18+17+19+14+11 = 79/140 Dota6.9 games and 61/140 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 79 - 3 = 76  games
Dota7 - draw = 61 - 8 = 53 games


Spoiler for Hiden:










- Day4:

Dota6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 152 games. Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
18/30     Draws: 1/0
20/30                 2/1
17/30                 1/3
17/30                 0/7
16/30                 1/5
0/2            - already calculated 2 draws for Dota7 as removed from total of 4 games, so 2 games for Dota7

Draws: Excluding 2 from the last page, Dota6.9 = 5 and Dota7 = 16 draws
18+20+17+17+16+0= 88/152 Dota6.9 games and 64/152 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 88 - 5 = 83 games
Dota7 - draw = 64 - 16 = 48 games


Spoiler for Hiden:












- Day5:

Dota6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 146 games.  Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
19/30     Draws:  2/1
18/30                 0/2
18/30                 1/1
17/30                 4/3
18/26                 1/2

Draws: Dota6.9 = 8 draws and Dota7 = 9 draws
19+18+18+17+18 = 90/146 Dota6.9 games and 56/146 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 90 - 8 = 82 games
Dota7 - draw = 56 - 9 = 45 games


Spoiler for Hiden:










- Day6:

Dota1 6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 6 pages 153 games.  Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
19/30     Draws:  1/1
17/30                 1/2
18/30                 2/1
16/30                 1/1
20/30                 2/4
01/03                 0/0

Draws: Dota6.9 = x draws and Dota7 = x draws
19+17+18+16+20+1 = 91/153 Dota6.9 games and 62/153 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 91 - 7 =  84 games
Dota7 - draw = 62 - 9 = 53 games


Spoiler for Hiden:












- Day7:

Dota1 6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 150 games.  Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
15/30     Draws:  1/1
19/30                 0/1
23/30                 2/0
16/30                 2/2
18/30                 0/2

Draws: Dota6.9 = 5 draws and Dota7 = 6 draws
15+19+23+16+18 = 91/150 Dota6.9 games and 59/150 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 91 - 5 = 86 games
Dota7 - draw = 59 - 6 = 53 games


Spoiler for Hiden:










- to1000:

Dota1 6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 2 pages 40 games.  Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
07/12     Draws:  0/1
15/28                 2/3


Draws: Dota6.9 = 2 draws and Dota7 = 4 draws
07+15 = 22/40 Dota6.9 games and 18/40 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 22 - 2 = 20 games
Dota7 - draw = 18 - 4 = 14 games


Spoiler for Hiden:



For confused fellas who ask what is Dota7:


ALL GAMES CALCULATED IN THE LAST 7 DAYS SINCE DEFAULT MAP CHANGE
AND AFTER ADVANTAGE  HAS BEEN GIVEN TO MINORITY MAP Dota7
to1000 are taken games from day8 for total of 1000games played statistic.

- Day1:
Dota6.9 - draw = 95 - 11 = 84 games
Dota7 - draw = 55 - 6 = 49 games

- Day2 part1:
Dota6.9 - draw = 67 - 9 = 58 games
Dota7 - draw = 53 - 13 = 40 games
- Day2 part2:
Dota6.9 - draw = 42 - 2 = 40 games
Dota7 - draw = 35 - 3 = 32 games

- Day3:
Dota6.9 - draw = 79 - 3 = 76  games
Dota7 - draw = 61 - 8 = 53 games

- Day4:
Dota6.9 - draw = 88 - 5 = 83 games
Dota7 - draw = 64 - 16 = 48 games

- Day5:
Dota6.9 - draw = 90 - 8 = 82 games
Dota7 - draw = 56 - 9 = 45 games

- Day6:
Dota6.9 - draw = 91 - 7 =  84 games
Dota7 - draw = 62 - 9 = 53 games

- Day7:
Dota6.9 - draw = 91 - 5 = 86 games
Dota7 - draw = 59 - 6 = 53 games

- to1000:
Dota6.9 - draw = 22 - 2 = 20 games
Dota7 - draw = 18 - 4 = 14 games

Dota6.9 = Day1+Day2part1+Day2part2+Day3+Day4+Day5+Day6+Day7+to1000 = 84+58+40+76+83+82+84+86+20= 613 map6.9 games finished

Dota7 = Day1+Day2part1+Day2part2+Day3+Day4+Day5+Day6+Day7+to1000 =
49+40+32+53+48+45+53+53+14= 387 map7.0 games finished


Total games played in last 7 days since default map change with 2 pages to get thousand games played = 613+387= 1000
For sure 5%-15% games are result of default dota7 map autopick on !pub command. 61% games at this moment are dota6.9 while real balance is for sure over 65% for dota6.9. Main question is without this help from !pub command does dota7 have over 30% of total games at all?
« Last Edit: December 17, 2020, 23:04 by mordor911 »

Offline Happy..

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2020, 09:01 »
Actually, when the v7 came out, a couple of months ago, there was a poll between v7 and v6 that resulted in v7 winning, even though a bunch of you morons kept creating fake profiles and double voting for v6. For reasons unknown to me, the transition hasn't been made.

Because of that, the majority of remotely decent players have left this platform which created an illusion that only '35%' of people here are playing v7.

Offline phaq

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2020, 09:56 »
Actually, when the v7 came out, a couple of months ago, there was a poll between v7 and v6 that resulted in v7 winning, even though a bunch of you morons kept creating fake profiles and double voting for v6. For reasons unknown to me, the transition hasn't been made.

Because of that, the majority of remotely decent players have left this platform which created an illusion that only '35%' of people here are playing v7.

Fake news. Nobody was sentenced as a result of the investigations. So there is no double voting situation.
#FreeNathanLarson

Offline cen

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2020, 11:13 »
You say that remembering to put l in a command is too hard but argue to split the bots into two channels which is 200% more confusing and will completely divide the player base on their own isolated islands.

l or c, who cares really, if I didn't write what it means nobody would even know, it is irrelavant, a single letter. 6.9 is a legacy map for the simple fact that it will not receive a single patch or update ever again as claimed by the creator. So it will eventually become just like Icefrog Dota.

!lobbies command can be improved to show which DotA is used for the game, this way you don't need to enter the game to find out.

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2020, 13:49 »
The "!Lobbies" command should be better improved with related version informations, nice idea. And I think it was the only missing thing we needed.
Never argue with idiots. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2020, 15:50 »
Quote
Because of that, the majority of remotely decent players have left this platform which created an illusion that only '35%' of people here are playing v7.

So now can be same situation where 6.9 players think 6.9 was removed and leave?

Offline mordor911

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Re: Dota6.9 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2020, 05:31 »
You say that remembering to put l in a command is too hard but argue to split the bots into two channels which is 200% more confusing and will completely divide the player base on their own isolated islands.
No, you completely misunderstood my point. Player base was already split with decision to put Dota7 as 2nd official dota and since then we have:
1. majority of Dota6.9 players who play mostly or only 6.9 map,
2. obviously small amount of people who play mostly or only Dota7, and
3. people who play both maps, again huge percent here is for Dota1 6.9 map.
Now why commands !pub and !publ are problem now, it is very simple logic: Lobbying group of few individuals made wrong picture about current situation and percent of players who play Dota7 and since this forum is used in most situations to ask for unban or ban, it is logical on some poll to not be much interests from regular Dota6.9 players who does not read much around. And so lobbying group, or few groups or few individuals wanted to make ideal environment and they presented fake picture.
None really care if it is publ or pubc or pubd or whatsoever, Default map is now Dota7 and side map is Dota6.9, every time someone wants to host Dota6.9 he has chance to have unintentionally created Dota7 instead which in the long run will make 5-25% of undecided players to use default map because it is default. I have valid solution on mind for this and votekick command gave me awesome idea where all sides will be happy:
Quote
13:39    Sir.Gawain    [Allies]    !votekick sir
13:39       [All]    [Sir.Gawain] voted to kick [Sir.Gawain] [1/7]
13:39       [All]    RULE: !votekick command may only be used against game ruiners (intentional feed, obstructing gameplay..). Vote accordingly.
13:39       [All]    Type !yes to vote.
When a player whisp to bot  /w la-dota !pub name , bellow that could go info about how to host Dota6.9 with /w la-dota !pubc name and /w la-dota !pubn , so player can pick which map he will host and not to be host default Dota7 map on just !pub name.

Quote
/w la-dota !pub name
You whisper to la-dota: !pub name

la-dota whispers: To host Dota6.9 map use /w la-dota !pubc name | To host Dota7.0 map use /w la-dota !pubn name
To repeat again, favoritism of Dota7 without reason is damaging Dota6.9 in the long run, and Dota6.9 need equality, the same treatment as Dota7 have, majority of players who play Dota6.9 deserve that. Now why same treatment with majority of players, this is Dota6.9 place and Dota6.9 must be official default map.
W3 channel can provide info about 2 channels for 2 dota games. And each channel info about game they play, Custom maps are supposed to have expected channel and bot name to makes all of this easy.

2 best players on ladder and on server for 2020 are Dota6.9 focused players Rob_Real and TooShade, and they were both untouchable for months until it was not really possible to progress anymore. Dota7 lobbying groups have their own clans to get higher on ladder and in different game, one more reason why 2 games need to be separated.
Ladder database https://dota.eurobattle.net/la/stats/ is overloaded. Loading page time takes often longer than 10 seconds. Can it be created that database as read_only(archived total games played) and 2 new databases, one for Dota6.9 and second for Dota7, on the first place to speed up, and on 2nd since we have 2 different games, not maps - GAMES. This will bring more challenging ladder for both leagues, ability to dominate in one or to try best to be the best in 2 leagues. I am sure cloning database and bot can bring us this very challenging fight to be in top.

l or c, who cares really, if I didn't write what it means nobody would even know, it is irrelavant, a single letter. 6.9 is a legacy map for the simple fact that it will not receive a single patch or update ever again as claimed by the creator. So it will eventually become just like Icefrog Dota.
You are Slovenian and you speak your language. If in your city is 20% Italians it doesn't mean you must to speak Italian as your primary language, right? Same case here. None care about new patches and updates, majority of people play it because 6.9 map is better than all previous maps. IceFrog dota compared to Dota6.9 is like comparing neanderthal who have his spear as weapon and alien who have laser weapon, but there are similarities between these maps while Dota7 is wild map, no connections with Dota6.9 nor IceFrog maps, dota2 maybe?.

Actually, when the v7 came out, a couple of months ago, there was a poll between v7 and v6 that resulted in v7 winning, even though a bunch of you morons kept creating fake profiles and double voting for v6. For reasons unknown to me, the transition hasn't been made.

Because of that, the majority of remotely decent players have left this platform which created an illusion that only '35%' of people here are playing v7.
Buggy non-dota map is not so attractive to Dota1 6.9 players, maybe to LOL and HON players..
Fake story about majority of decent players is bullshit. We all know who they are now, famous players for game ruining, mid or feed, failing mid and insulting and raging all game long at others for self-incompetence, rage quit. Luckily not many players like that are left in Dota6.9 so its much more comfortable to play. My best guess is they all went to Dota7.


The most shocking info is since last night Dota7 had 19 games remakes, while Dota6.9 had only 5. Dota7 lobbying group took me seriously so they had to hard try to make some balance in total games  ;)


- Day4:

Dota1 6.9 games played since switch, every page has 30 games in total on 5 pages 152 games. Draw games info is added next to number of games in format Dota6.9/Dota7:
18/30     Draws: 1/0
20/30                 2/1
17/30                 1/3
17/30                 0/7
16/30                 1/5
0/2            - already calculated 2 draws for Dota7 as removed from total of 4 games, so 2 games for Dota7

Draws: Excluding 2 from the last page, Dota6.9 = 5 and Dota7 = 16 draws
18+20+17+17+16+0= 88/152 Dota6.9 games and 64/152 Dota7 games
Dota6.9 - draw = 88 - 5 = 83 games
Dota7 - draw = 64 - 16 = 48 games


Spoiler for Hiden:










« Last Edit: December 10, 2020, 06:14 by mordor911 »

Offline Happy..

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2020, 11:18 »
1. majority of Dota1 players who play mostly or only 6.9 map,
2. obviously small amount of people who play mostly or only Dota7

There is no such thing as Dota7, just an updated, better map. It's the same game.

And so lobbying group, or few groups or few individuals wanted to make ideal environment and they presented fake picture.

There are no lobbying groups on Lagabuse, this is not House of Cards.

Dota1 need equality, the same treatment as Dota7 have


Dota7 does not exist.

majority of players who play Dota1 deserve that.

Majority of players that play Dota1 actually play version7.

2 best players on ladder and on server for 2020 are Dota1 focused players Rob_Real and TooShade

@grga_man @MarvinJunior rate
Also, @MarvinJunior I was under the impression Grga was the only focused Dota1 player?

and they were both untouchable for months until it was not really possible to progress anymore.

Didn't they get accused on multiple occasions of stacking vs total imbeciles and kicking any remotely decent player that entered their lobby?

Dota7 lobbying groups have their own clans to get higher on ladder

Dota7 does not exist, neither do lobbying groups, nor clans.

Can it be created that database as read_only(archived total games played) and 2 new databases, one for Dota1 and second for Dota7

It's the same game, so that's completely pointless.

majority of people play it because 6.9 map is better than all previous maps.

Just because this server has reached its lowest point and the skill-level in the history of Eurobattle, it does not mean most people play v6. The vast majority of Dota1 community play v7.

Actually, when the v7 came out, a couple of months ago, there was a poll between v7 and v6 that resulted in v7 winning, even though a bunch of you morons kept creating fake profiles and double voting for v6. For reasons unknown to me, the transition hasn't been made.

Because of that, the majority of remotely decent players have left this platform which created an illusion that only '35%' of people here are playing v7.

Buggy non-dota map is not so attractive to Dota1 players, maybe to LOL and HON players..

It is, in fact, a Dota map, it's way less 'buggy' than v6 and since a majority of D1 players play it, it's indeed attractive to them.

Fake story about majority of decent players is bullshit.

It's not fake and it's a fact.

My best guess is they all went to Dota7.

There is no such thing as Dota7.

Dota7 lobbying group took me seriously

Lobbying groups do not exist, and no one takes you seriously.

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #8 on: December 09, 2020, 15:49 »
I have competition for being best focused player on d1, trully fascinating how they are best players i always rape too shade in games, sadly i wont play old map so im not in position to do it more.
By question of fairy, i rate 9/10 because they have patience to wait all day stacked vs 1300 players to earn "points" which means nothing

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2020, 17:10 »
:DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
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SO, IF YOU WILL BE IN THIS STATE EVER, GO AND FIGHT IT, LOL

Offline luke

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2020, 17:24 »
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Dota7 lobbying group took me seriously

I think they just join game, see its 7.00 and they want 6.9 and leave

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this server has reached its lowest point and the skill-level in the history of Eurobattle

Agree

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    2 best players on ladder and on server for 2020 are Dota1 focused players Rob_Real and TooShade

« Last Edit: December 09, 2020, 17:29 by luke »

Offline Arthas

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2020, 22:05 »
You say that remembering to put l in a command is too hard but argue to split the bots into two channels which is 200% more confusing and will completely divide the player base on their own isolated islands.

l or c, who cares really, if I didn't write what it means nobody would even know, it is irrelavant, a single letter. 6.9 is a legacy map for the simple fact that it will not receive a single patch or update ever again as claimed by the creator. So it will eventually become just like Icefrog Dota.

!lobbies command can be improved to show which DotA is used for the game, this way you don't need to enter the game to find out.
why do you run this server man?
for fun for gain whatever the reason but you have to give the players what they want or they will just fuck off...do it the right way.

and why the old map wont receive any update ??????
did you try to fix tuskar bug?
why you didnt add the new items on 6.90

instead of changing the whole 6.90 you could add and fix...and you should know that upgrades is not forever on ....you may improve the base.!.but.!.at some point when you reach perfection upgrade should stop ...means any change or add will make it worse.

here is what i want as a player in this server:

1-fix tuskar bug in 6.90

2-add the new items in v7 to v6.90 without changing anything of map features

and you are right add l or fuck to commands is nothing but you guys want to force the new map on players ...and we all knew that since the first appearance of the new map


« Last Edit: December 09, 2020, 22:32 by Arthas »

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2020, 22:20 »
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1-fix tuskar bug in 6.90

2-add the new items in v7 to v6.90 without changing anything of map features


Offline kna

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2020, 02:30 »
So tell me one fucking decent reason to not flame this stupid mongoliads for typing this crap throw all week , and asking to play on 6.90

Offline MarvinJunior

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Re: Dota1 and Dota7 comparison, statistics and suggestions
« Reply #14 on: December 10, 2020, 02:35 »
@mordor911 @TooShade @Rob_Real

I challenge you guys to a 3v3 or 5v5, hit me up with the date