Author Topic: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?  (Read 2977 times)

Offline territory23

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Hi again,

Well, you said a lot about high PSR feeders before.

Just check this game.

http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6245718

-Deadly- He is Number 1 in ladder - had higest PSR so far. He stayed on mid until he reach lvl 12. By the time, other team was ganking us 10s of  times:)

At the end game finished 3-31, with no help from mid. When he decide that he farmed enough, game was over.

This must be a new record for "balanced" game.

I tnik we need to talk about the reasons. It can be a high psr going mid and being useless in game. It can be the perfect balance system causing 3-31 kills game. It can be...?

We can check the history of each player here. I am sure that we played many games and nobody is noob.

If a "balanced" game finishes 3-31, we need to talk about the reasons.

I offered to ban high psr, mid players who goes useless and makes team lose, but it was ignored.

So, what is gonna be? Is it normal to have 3-31 game in this balance system? 

Offline .SaLiH.

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SO, IF YOU WILL BE IN THIS STATE EVER, GO AND FIGHT IT, LOL

Offline FataLity-

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2020, 20:05 »
discrimination against high psr players
cen update the map please

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2020, 20:11 »
What do you suggest to improve balancing?

Offline tehnika8x8

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2020, 20:32 »
This world is not a perfect place, so is this system. Shit happens. The system dont knows emotions. Each of us has a bad day proving that we are only humans and not machines. First of all this is a game and we are all here to have fun. Sometimes things dont go as planned. I advise you to enjoy the little things because I repeat this is just a game. No need for one more drama  :peace:

Offline .SaLiH.

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SO, IF YOU WILL BE IN THIS STATE EVER, GO AND FIGHT IT, LOL

Offline Deynro

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2020, 22:01 »
*facepalm*

You already debated this in:

http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?topic=188086.msg688103#msg688103

You want attention or what?

Come with a method or a suggestion to change it or your topics are totally pointless, just words throwed randomly with a dumb perspective
https://www.twitch.tv/deynro

Don't give up on your dreams, keep sleeping.


Offline Mara

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2020, 22:07 »
You lost game with (one of) best mider player in realm  and you open topic like this?:D shame, i suggest you to check this replay how to use this player like me.
http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6245637

maybe if you ward map from start like me with some support so he see the gangs  instead of picking retarded carry...And game wouldt be ower.Imagine what would happen in that game if i pick Slark and no one buy wards.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2020, 22:12 by Mara »
Spoiler for Hiden:

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2020, 22:12 »
You lost game with (one of) best mider player in realm  and you open topic like this?:D shame, i suggest you to check this replay how to use this player like me.
http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6245637

maybe if you ward map from start like me with some support so he see the gangs  instead of picking retarded carry...And game wouldt be ower.
  :y:

Offline [Dis]Kealthas

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2020, 22:28 »
Sure deynro is blockhead when it comes to team(like most player who are a ''bit closer to my skills :P ) but if u just bought 1-2 wards and played safe he would solo win for you just be grateful about it . i am not saying balance system is best which i think we dont need psr system just counting wins lose are enough but w/e

Offline 3zz3

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2020, 01:26 »
Sure deynro is blockhead when it comes to team(like most player who are a ''bit closer to my skills :P ) but if u just bought 1-2 wards and played safe he would solo win for you just be grateful about it . i am not saying balance system is best which i think we dont need psr system just counting wins lose are enough but w/e

I do agree that removing kill/death/assist and creep stats would be for the best, because there are people who play for stats, and there are people who judge others based on stats, thats one of the reason why you see so many "carry" players.
why not add just bronze gold dimond ranks and delete the psr system bronze ranked playres play whit bronzes gold playres play whit gold and dimond playres play whit dimond or someting like that

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2020, 07:58 »
Sure deynro is blockhead when it comes to team(like most player who are a ''bit closer to my skills :P ) but if u just bought 1-2 wards and played safe he would solo win for you just be grateful about it . i am not saying balance system is best which i think we dont need psr system just counting wins lose are enough but w/e

I do agree that removing kill/death/assist and creep stats would be for the best, because there are people who play for stats, and there are people who judge others based on stats, thats one of the reason why you see so many "carry" players.
why not add just bronze gold dimond ranks and delete the psr system bronze ranked playres play whit bronzes gold playres play whit gold and dimond playres play whit dimond or someting like that
On what should we base the ranking? Just points (stats non included)?

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2020, 08:09 »
Copy from Private, among many suggestions i dig up this one, seemed ontopic.

I dont know where, but ill post here , if wrong place, remove.
K/A/D removal , or replacing it with a Simple Win/Lose formula would improve the Community and Game quality immensly.
It would reduce the Game Ruin drastically due to the simple fact that it would change the mind-set of the regular gamer to be based on the purpose of winning, therefore making Sabotage,Anti-Teamplay,and various other offences self-damaging.


Other improvement would be regarding XPAM issued bans replacing BOT issued bans.
examplary :
Family Flame /National-Religious Inolerance = 1 Day Lock.
Game Ruin [All Sections] = 2 Day Lock.
Lagabuse Bot Moderation center would be used to apply Warns ,therefore influencing Lock duration in future sanctions.

This and above posted change would Greatly improve the overall Quality of DotA on our server.
During the years as Lagabuse Staff i suggested these things , but understandably it is a sensitive matter therefore it eluded serious action or even discussion.
I am glad that XPAM Staff decided to intervene ,this is my overall sum of needed changes for 8 years Observation during my time in Staff.
Hopefully it isnt late,and changes will attract Members from RGC who at the moment provide less toxic Community and Better Game Quality due to the changes that are similar to what i suggested here.
Regards

Offline Jimmy

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2020, 08:26 »
And the reply, which include more or less the essence of sugestion.

The first point is not to be ignored.
The KDA algo is not beneficial if you go abuse killing and lose the game in an unbelievable manner.
Even so, the W/L sequence is not better either. Yes, it can be considered an upgrade because at the end of the game the win is more important than what you've been "toxic with".
(i'm gonna say "you", as you guys are the ones to decide this)
You need to make a more complex ladder system, having both KDA and W/L as a stand-off.
I believe in the statement: "you can be a very good dying all the time part of the team hero".
Maybe you can come up with a better "reward by game" feature that can include both KDA and W/L. (Take other games as examples, check how they do it, see if You can make something similar,etc)
Thank you for the feedback, on this matter , me and Luke had a long and productive conversation about this over long period of time.
We came to the next Conclusion over what would be most practical[open to modification].
1. Win/Lose would be the base Line [Rating would be Kept].
Meaning that player would be getting increased Rating for wins ,and vice versa.
K/D/A would removed totally, BUT Creep count would be kept [to satisfy to some point the statistical demand of Complex filled crybabys who want to showcase their superiority to the Cumwaste who have the Privilege to be in the same game with him].
We had a small discussion about keeping K/D/A with a smaller formula that would replace K/D/A aswell as Creep statistic. meaning :
15 Kills[Or more] 5 Deaths[Or less] 10 Assists[Or more] = Class  SS
10-15 Kills  /  5-8 Deaths / 5-8 Assists = Class A
5-10 Kills / 8-11 Deaths / 3-5 Assists = Class B
0-5 Kills / 11-14 Deaths / 0-3 Assists = Class C

This would keep the statistics that very build , and would be displayed in example[ !check Jimmy] Command . !SD Jimmy command would display [ 1720 Rating / 120 Wins-43 Losses - 189 CS Kills/21 CS Deny]. If formula would be to difficult to implement due to lack of coders available ,then it would be kept under the carpet, even tho i think i can Torture MyUberNick to help us with this and find a way for this to work.


For the 2nd part:
I do not believe a public league should be considered a deciding factor to apply server punishment.
But ... this one was split in two opposite actions:
a) Family Flame /National-Religious Inolerance = 1 Day Lock.
b) Game Ruin [All Sections] = 2 Day Lock.

Taking each point as a sub topic:
a) This is a global offense and should be treated like one.
We're a friendly community who doesn't tolerate such behavior. But this is not to be over-hyped on, we are going to have to pass this to server staff management.
We can figure out the best way to implement this.

b) Any kind of inhouse public league abuse by a user ->" i want to stay in base all god damn dota games no matter my downrank" can not and will not be punished globally.

AP

Im glad that you accepted this suggestion the way you did, portion of my intentions when i wrote this you understood, the most important part.
We [XPAM-Lagabuse] have no tolerance for Rule breakers, Xpam stands behind punishment of any kind of people making Gaming experience for the general population unfriendly. Therefore the Drastically reduced durations .
My biggest finger-pointing part is that it would make Ban Evading impossible, this is a cancer in the heart of our server that has made so much problems and allowed Mass Game Ruiners[Who are one of the few that are available for IP check and Lock] to destroy many games , and also while on this point, made Alot of people leave our server and go to Other Platforms or simply change the game. It is a hidden-Dont Speak about it-But we all know it  Problem that literally 95% of Lagabuse is avoiding ban.

Offline nikolagay

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Re: Still not thinking of banning balance fuckers?
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2020, 12:30 »
Spoiler for Hiden:
Hi again,

Well, you said a lot about high PSR feeders before.

Just check this game.

http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6245718

-Deadly- He is Number 1 in ladder - had higest PSR so far. He stayed on mid until he reach lvl 12. By the time, other team was ganking us 10s of  times:)

At the end game finished 3-31, with no help from mid. When he decide that he farmed enough, game was over.

This must be a new record for "balanced" game.

I tnik we need to talk about the reasons. It can be a high psr going mid and being useless in game. It can be the perfect balance system causing 3-31 kills game. It can be...?

We can check the history of each player here. I am sure that we played many games and nobody is noob.

If a "balanced" game finishes 3-31, we need to talk about the reasons.

I offered to ban high psr, mid players who goes useless and makes team lose, but it was ignored.

So, what is gonna be? Is it normal to have 3-31 game in this balance system?

I'm a bit late to hit you with a logic train here, but oh well.

First off, being triggered over a game of Dota 1? It's fine to be upset about losing and all cause you did invest your valuable time into this, but this is a bit overdramatic (telling you this cause I used to be like this as well so it's somewhat relatable).

Second, you can never trust the balance cause scums (including myself) will either find a way to manipulate it, or simply because there's more into it than actual numbers (e.g. hero matchups, individuals will to tryhard / troll, casuals, etc.).

Third, banning high PSR players when they don't meet your expectations? REALLY? Do we even need to discuss the lack of logic behind this?

Fourth, if you feel the need to tryhard in games that's fine, but expecting others to do the same for yours sake is kinda unfair.

Shitty games are destined to happen every now and then, regardless of the balance / ranking system. Not just here, it's a common thing in all games, even in highly competitive matchups (e.g. PSG.LGD vs Evil Geniuses, TI 2018 semi-finals). On Lagabuse in particular, losing with Deynro in your team is quite a rarity, even I do not look forward to laning aginst him but I still do it for the sake of fun.

I'm fine with proposing rational ideas which could inprove the community, but banning those few good players you have left here because they can't (or more likely, won't) meet their expected standards is a huge no for me.

In short, shit games will happen - get over it and move on, for your own sake.