Author Topic: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)  (Read 2665 times)

Offline iErnesto94

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #30 on: October 07, 2019, 20:08 »
I really cant see how this new system is an improvement.
Since for me psr is a good motivation to play and currently for me getting psr feels a complete nonsense I wont play anymore. I hope you will bring back the old system.


Offline luke

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #31 on: October 08, 2019, 20:25 »
There are only 2 main directions of how ranking points can be calculated based on myubernick's formula.

1) You have a big amount of imaginary points due to high psr players being protected in "noob games" which means that there is a huge gap between high psr players and average players.

Result: You don't lose much psr in games but you get bad games more frequently due to low psr teammates, a lot of complaints about "i must smurf because i get only noobs in team"

2) High psr players aren't protected and they lose significantly more psr when playing in "noob games".

Result: high psr players cry that they lose a lot of psr and have +1/-5 ratios but the games should be better due to a better distribution of psr. The psr gap doesn't exist.

The formula now is a something between these 2 approaches: high psr players get protected less and lose more psr in "noob games", the gap is still there but barely reachable.

If you ask me, the only way to have fair games is option 2, unless the whole elo system is changed. Of course, there is a PSR CAP for extremely good players depending on the rating median of the league, if you are interested, check about elo systems, it is a typical approach in many other games and is, in my opinion, completely fair.

Switching the formula midseason obviously puts high psr players at disadvantage. The "progress" seems to be negative because of it.

To speak in other words, no matter what the formula is, high psr players will cry either about "getting only noobs in games" (old formula) or "losing too much psr" (new formula). I think that the new formula is better because it should make games more balanced and the only real disadvantage is that some people will have lower imaginary numbers than before (instead of 1900 psr, pros will have around 1750)
« Last Edit: October 08, 2019, 20:30 by luke »

Offline cen

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #32 on: October 08, 2019, 22:10 »
As mr deer said this is a feedback topic, I will collect all the ideas here (some good already) and then decide how to move forward. Let's set the deadline to the end of this week.

Offline Sejanus

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #33 on: October 11, 2019, 19:14 »
Changes are the following..

If player's rating (PSR) is lower than his team's average:
- in case of victory player gains more PSR
- in case of defeat player loses less PSR

If player's rating (PSR) is higher than his team's average:
- in case of victory player gains less PSR
- in case of defeat player loses more PSR

In equally balanced games you gain same amount as PSR as you lose.

Positive and negative feedback is welcome. Also let us know if you see any anomalies in PSR gain/lose and !rall anomalies.

Love it, works way better.

Should consider stat reset now.

Offline Happy..

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #34 on: October 11, 2019, 21:29 »
Also, you could code in some imaginary currency that's tiding to one's account. Per each win you get 5 PSR + 5 *currency name*. After you collect 100 *currency name* you can trade it for some priviliges like the name color in the channel, in the game or something like that, people seem to like that shit. This way you can add more value to accounts.

Offline Jimmy

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #35 on: October 11, 2019, 22:01 »
Also, you could code in some imaginary currency that's tiding to one's account. Per each win you get 5 PSR + 5 *currency name*. After you collect 100 *currency name* you can trade it for some priviliges like the name color in the channel, in the game or something like that, people seem to like that shit. This way you can add more value to accounts.
I proposed something similar lately ,sort of.
Collecting 100-300-500 Clean games can be Exchanged for Icons/PSR or some other award.
But we didnt discuss about collecting PSR , since award for that is being the VIP at the end of the Season, getting all the stuff from that [coloured Nickname,Private Chat, Etc].

Offline grga_man

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #36 on: October 11, 2019, 22:41 »
Also, you could code in some imaginary currency that's tiding to one's account. Per each win you get 5 PSR + 5 *currency name*. before you collect 100 *currency name* you can trade it for some priviliges like the name color in the channel, in the game or something like that, people seem to like that shit. This way you can add more value to accounts.

give fairy that colour name already, so he can stop crying today..

Offline Meth0d

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #37 on: October 12, 2019, 00:24 »
Also, you could code in some imaginary currency that's tiding to one's account. Per each win you get 5 PSR + 5 *currency name*. before you collect 100 *currency name* you can trade it for some priviliges like the name color in the channel, in the game or something like that, people seem to like that shit. This way you can add more value to accounts.

give fairy that colour name already, so he can stop crying today..

agree.

Offline luke

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #38 on: February 03, 2020, 17:15 »
unsticky please, im not working on this anymore

Also, i would like my visualizing software to be deleted from a certain topic in private area
« Last Edit: February 03, 2020, 17:44 by luke »

Offline myprecious

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #39 on: February 03, 2020, 18:46 »
Ohhh nice something new, let's see how that working, but I think it is good change, not sure why ernesto disagree.

Offline pastmistake

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #40 on: February 05, 2020, 18:47 »
As long as anyone with any PSR joins game, there;s no magical PSR formula. You either favor the lower ranked or the higher ranked. There shouldn't be allowed games where top PSR is 1600+ and lowest is 1400- .. those will never be balanced games or PSR worth.

Any formula you'll pick is still abusable: I;m currently with 3 acc in top 15,  and going up. Without stacking or choosing games. B O R I N G

« Last Edit: February 05, 2020, 18:54 by pastmistake »

Offline pastmistake

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #41 on: February 05, 2020, 18:53 »
A proper balancing formula shouldn;t try to match exact PSR total. PSR_Team 1 = PSR_Team2. Rather it should place each player in a "category level".

Ex.
1600 - 1699 .. is considered 5
1550 - 1599 .. is considered 4
1500 - 1550 .. is considered 3
1450 - 1500 .. is considered 2
< 1400 is considered 1

and then u try to balance those category levels in each team. Ofc presented numbers are to explain the logic, and do not represent the final formula.

PS: the main factor in imbalanced games is the periodical ladder reset and the fact ppl can multiaccount and smurf. There should be no ladder reset, as the current formulas already drag down the top ranks from going too far ahead and it makes easier for new players to climb fast to the mid-section of the ladder.

So rather than changing formula, you should rather prioritize something to make users use only 1 account. Some rewarding system or w/e.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2020, 18:59 by pastmistake »

Offline luke

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #42 on: February 06, 2020, 03:17 »
I know, i was testing various options

Problems with new accounts occur in all games, nothing to do about it. After 1 game was played, skill level can be determined to match with appropriate players.

As said main problem here is that there is no automatic matching system. I can make 1 particular game perfectly balanced based on stats and psr but in the long run it destroys the ladder, which was why i decided to not use this approach. High skilled players would be pressured too hard by having to carry bad players since there are not enough of good players around. At the same time they would barely get any psr in case of winning and lose a lot in case of defeat.

If it helps, my closest idea was to equalize win/lose in fair games and reduce lose penalty for low psr players (since if you have 1300 psr its VERY hard to climb up while when you have 1600 you cant go down)

Offline cen

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #43 on: February 06, 2020, 19:46 »
New PSR formula will be enabled next season to see how it works on level playing field from the beginning. The only reason we didn't try it out in January already is that I simply forgot due to all the work with season reset.

Offline luke

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Re: New PSR formula is live from today (30.9.2019)
« Reply #44 on: February 06, 2020, 20:23 »
I said that i stopped working on it but i didn't say that its complete.

You can try to use it on your own risk, but in this formula high psr players are punished way too hard in my opinion (this type of formulas will probably not work here at all due to the lack of high psr players. I estimate the median to be around 1550-1600 with this while people who manage to get above 1700 will be hard punished and quickly lose motivation, unless they like challenges). I think that my and mun's approach should be mixed to have an acceptable result.

Again, i said that this isn't complete and that i'm against using it. If anything goes wrong, please don't put the blame me.