LagAbuse.com
General Section => Suggestion Board => Topic started by: NEGERTIVS on September 26, 2010, 21:00
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Referring to http://playdota.eu/forum/index.php/topic,21724.msg67392.html (http://playdota.eu/forum/index.php/topic,21724.msg67392.html)
I would like to hear the motivation behind this decision. This guy stopped playing for no other reason than "omg my team is nub", putting us in a 4v5 situation WITHOUT extra leavergold for the remainder of the game, thus ruining it for us ánd the scourge. This, ofcourse, is a textbook example to the rule "Player must not stop playing and ruining the game. "
Furthermore, he selected my hero and sold all my items when I wasnt paying attention, again a textbook example of share abuse. Though I see that for some reason the rule "Player must not use units, that don’t belong to him (left players, shared control…), only if the user controling the units does not want it;" has been cleverly appended in the meantime (for reasons beyond (my) logic).
I simply do not understand this decion. Did this dude happen to be the admin's "bestest buddy"? Was it "lame" of me to share my courier with the rest of the team? Please help me in understanding.
Some of my friends from the PD.com scene told me that this is a "mikey mouse bot run by illiterate eastern ethernopians", but I have always enjoyed playing on this bot. Seeing more and more examples of how you set down supposedly strict rules, yet make completely arbitrary and seemingly random decisions makes me wonder if I should take this bot seriously.
The rules are improperly defined (and improperly spelled), for example the rule "If number of players in the opposing team is greater than 3 players and the game mode includes -so (-switchon) you are free to leave the game without ban;": if one interprets this rule litterally, one could leave at the start of the game, since the opponent will have 5 (more than 3) players on it's team.
For example: http://clanbase.ggl.com/rules.php?lid=11231 (http://clanbase.ggl.com/rules.php?lid=11231) would be a properly defined set of rules.
The choice of how you run this bot is, ofcourse, up to you. You could run it based on a loose behavior code or set down a set of strict rules. You have opted for the latter, but the rules are not set down right and the admins do not stick to them. I think there should be a major remake of the rules and possibly some sort of control organ, to see to it that the admins actually do their job. Right now, the banrequest system is barely functioning and people lose interest in even trying to get lamers banned.
TL;DR This bot is losing it's credibility with the public.
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-Unfortunetly for you arkshu / _hellion_ has different view of rules and i think many others do ,and you have to like or not.You always have option to contact other mod so they can see it as well if they have time to take care of it.
-As for rules themselves ,there are always strict rules,but there are always so called reeferes as you said ,like you posted there who have their own oppinion and they are the one to think ,and you cant judge it.
Like in football,you know there is rule not to hurt other player or oppoment team can get free penal,but some reeferes can see that other way and thats what can make you pissed ,angry.
But in this case you have only one more option,as i said,contact other mod.
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We will review that negertivs!
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-Unfortunetly for you arkshu / _hellion_ has different view of rules and i think many others do ,and you have to like or not.You always have option to contact other mod so they can see it as well if they have time to take care of it.
Ofcourse rules are (and must always be) open to interpretation. This admin (or mod or whatever) however has stretched interpretation to it's breaking point, by denying a ban on someone who is utterly clearly and beyond any shred of doubt guilty on both charges. It's like a referee denying a goal from a 30 meter shot, for "offside"! I myself cannot think of any redeeming argument whatsoever for this player.
@Mrniceguy, thanks! Best of luck and I hope that the community will benefit from it, whatever you decide.
*edit: some random quotes from the game:
Sos 24:40 stupid fucking noonb team
Sos 24:42 i go afk
Sos 24:44 kick me
Sos 24:48 !votekick sos
Sos 28:28 !votekick sos
NEGERTIVS 29:19 wow.
NEGERTIVS 29:45 you are beyond pathetic.
NEGERTIVS 30:03 he just share abused -.-
Sos 33:08 it was when i saw that i have 3 retards on team
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man to be onest....we(mods)have to think like a plyer dose.....if u ware in his situation when the team was owned 0/5 3/9 3/5 did u play anymore????and it wasnt afk....he spoke with the team...he farm in woods
he just stop playing for his stats y guess and to not improve the enemys stats....a right decision....if y was in that game....if y was him....y whold do the same
y wont ban a guy who wont play cose his team just feed the others....
y wont ban a player who will stop playing just cose dont have a team to play....
DOTA means TEAM PLAy if u dont have team why to play???
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man to be onest....we(mods)have to think like a plyer dose.....if u ware in his situation when the team was owned 0/5 3/9 3/5 did u play anymore????and it wasnt afk....he spoke with the team...he farm in woods
he just stop playing for his stats y guess and to not improve the enemys stats....a right decision....if y was in that game....if y was him....y whold do the same
y wont ban a guy who wont play cose his team just feed the others....
y wont ban a player who will stop playing just cose dont have a team to play....
DOTA means TEAM PLAy if u dont have team why to play???
Really? You have to think like the players do? What about the NINE other players whose game he ruined? Ever think about them?
He wasn't afk no, thats why the rules say player must not stop playing. He did not defend, he did not enter teambattles, he did nothing to help us win. And he only "farmed" for a very short time. For most of the game, he was in our fountain. DotA is a team game you say? Well I could not agree more.
Stats? Really? I can imagine why lobotomized pubbie weasels think stats are more important than actually winning the game, but I didnt expect this from a mod. So let me explain this one more time:
Stats
are
irrelevant.
If you cannot understand this, then you should seriously consider quitting dota. If you want to play in a ranking system, enter a tournament with a team. These are pubs, with no safelist or anything in effect and the only thing it can be used for is determining whether a given player is "pro" (another pubbie term) or not. Except for jacking off to your wins, the stat system has no other use whatsoever.
DotA is indeed a team game. If you don't contribute to the team on purpose, then you are not playing ánd ruining the game. You do not have to be afk for this. You could stand in a corner juggling branches for all I care, you are not contributing, you are not helping defend, you are not participating in team battles. And in pubs, the players you play with are random. If I stopped playing every time I had a couple of noobs in my team, I wouldnt be able to finish a single game!
Seriously what is this guy doing in the mod pool? He is incapable of even remotely coherent english (and he cannot spell, "y" instead of "I" lmfao), and his rule interpretation and logic are idiotic at best. Stats as an argument? "team nub" as a valid reason to stop playing? Are you trolling or what? :D
Just laughable, I feel like Im teaching a twelve year old.
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and what to play if u dont have team aaa????what???alone'???
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and what to play if u dont have team aaa????what???alone'???
He had a team. Or do I (and several other sentinel players) not exist? Difficult question, that one. Just because we were losing does not give him an excuse to stop playing. Do you have Asperger's?
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no because u are lose...because u feed....
anyway....
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I detect no logic whatsoever in this. We lose, so there is no team? What the hell is that even supposed to mean? I did not feed, my score was 3-5-6. It seems you have completely the wrong idea of how dota is supposed to work!
I have proven you wrong on at least two counts now, and I havent even started yet on the share abuse ban, which you denied and still owe me a motivation for. Instead of actually providing me valid arguments, you choose to reply with retarded oneliners which make no sense and are based on nothing.
I remember reading a "mod recruiting" post a couple of weeks ago with some criteria. Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to find the post, but let's juxtapose the ones I can remember with your abilities, shall we?
- You do not possess acceptable english skills
- You do not know the rules
- You do not reply professionally and properly
Are there any administrators reading up on this? Perhaps it is time to evaluate the mod pool!
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btw go and check the req
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hhiihihihhii
http://playdota.eu/forum/index.php/topic,21724.0.html (http://playdota.eu/forum/index.php/topic,21724.0.html)
Reply #2 on: Today at 17:01:44 »
!banned 10days+warn
!Locked
today -->27.9
bfr u write a reply again write
!unlocked
....
!locked
axaxxax
joke :P
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We will review that negertivs!
Done and solved, sry for inconvenience!
Cheers!
P.S. Playdota.eu08 (http://www.ridethatpony.com/yellowcard.jpg)
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Wow. Well, interesting thread. Arkshu's English is beyond redemption... Also, his views about DotA, especially knowing he is a mod, are odd, to say the least. 0.o
The most depressing thing though is the fact that you have to start a thread like this to get a proper verdict on a simple ban request...
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He done it on perfect way!
But he could sent me pm, it would save him lot of time :D!
Peace!
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Wow. Well, interesting thread. Arkshu's English is beyond redemption... Also, his views about DotA, especially knowing he is a mod, are odd, to say the least. 0.o
The most depressing thing though is the fact that you have to start a thread like this to get a proper verdict on a simple ban request...
True. I dont see one single reason or excuse why this guy wasnt banned in the first place. If not for refusing to play, which is itself reason enough, because i believe that the whole team or at least the majority of the team should stop playing for it to be excused, then at least for his share abuse..
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Well it's good to see justice has been served, makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside. I don't usually pm administrators with these kinds of problems, because in some fora it can have nasty side effects (such as getting banned for "harassment") ;D
I hope there will be some major changes in the rules soon, to make them more clear for everybody. But seriously, please sweep a broom through the mod ranks, some of these people are beyond retarded and just not suited for the job (as illustrated in the above rant novels and no doubt in your own experiences here).
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(such as getting banned for "harassment") ;D
Do not worry about that, any pm i get it is private!
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This entire thread just goes to show that PD needs higher standards for staff recruitment (or needs to enforce those standards better, dunno).
If this were a lone, isolated case of incompetent modding, it'd be bad enough, but unfortunately there are other mods as well who make irrational and rule-defying decisions for no apparent reason.
Oh, and have someone who knows English rewrite the rules, right now they're a real eyesore.
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Anyone could applied for mod!
I did not seen yours or anyone else who is writing posts like yours application!
It is easy to accuse but is hard to take the job!
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We are not looking for new moderators anymore at the moment
Though if you were, Id consider applying
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Well, I had large signature "We are searching for new mods" about 1 month, so anyone who was active here could seen it!
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MrNiceGuy i looked at your sign-from-the-future. Will Duddic annoy us 'till 2032? :-[
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Hmm is it my bad eye sight or ......
http://img832.imageshack.us/f/47365854.jpg/ (http://img832.imageshack.us/f/47365854.jpg/)
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source xpam (http://www.eurobattle.net) ban list:
dudicc Map Hacker Link 1 MiZiGe Banned 19-08-2010 Permanent
dudicc. Map Hacker MiZiGe Banned aka dudicc 24-08-2010 Permanent
MiZiGe_v_dudicc Map Hacker MiZiGe Banned 24-08-2010 Permanent
Why would be ban someone who is not able to log into www.eurobattle.net (http://www.eurobattle.net)!!!
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Ohhh banned form eb .. ;D
well i thnk reinstall eb and change ip is all needed to play again ;D unfortunetly .... he plays on fawkz bnet now
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Wow. Well, interesting thread. Arkshu's English is beyond redemption... Also, his views about DotA, especially knowing he is a mod, are odd, to say the least. 0.o
The most depressing thing though is the fact that you have to start a thread like this to get a proper verdict on a simple ban request...
Or he could have just pmed another mod, and asked him/her to look at it.
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Ohhh banned form eb .. ;D
well i thnk reinstall eb and change ip is all needed to play again ;D unfortunetly .... he plays on fawkz bnet now
Not on that nickname for sure!
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Or he could have just pmed another mod, and asked him/her to look at it.
Aside from setting this ban issue straight, I wanted to bring the underlying problem to the attention of the public, namely the vagueness of the rules and the idiocy and incompetence of a significant number of ban mods, as well as to publicly expose this mod's incompetence. I hope my intentions are clear now.
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Or he could have just pmed another mod, and asked him/her to look at it.
Aside from setting this ban issue straight, I wanted to bring the underlying problem to the attention of the public, namely the vagueness of the rules and the idiocy and incompetence of a significant number of ban mods, as well as to publicly expose this mod's incompetence. I hope my intentions are clear now.
Keep up the good work !
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Anyone could applied for mod!
I did not seen yours or anyone else who is writing posts like yours application!
It is easy to accuse but is hard to take the job!
+1
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Anyone could applied for mod!
I did not seen yours or anyone else who is writing posts like yours application!
It is easy to accuse but is hard to take the job!
This is very true. And we are very, VERY thankful for you guys for running this bot and the forums for free, not asking for anything in return. It is a great thing.
But let's not get confused on one thing. You guys have agreed to do something, you have applied to be mods, and you have been accepted. Now it is your duty to do it, and to do it the best you can, and to do it according to the rules. If you think you've had enough, or that you can't do it full hearted, or if you don't have enough free time, you can quit. We would still be very grateful for the work you have done here, keep quoting you and referring to you, and it would be hard to replace any one of you. But until you are here, do what you do right.
Please, don't get this the wrong way. We really need you guys, and you really do a great job here.
But you were the ones who applied, and agreed to be eg. ban/unban mods, not us, so now you are the ones that solve our problems, you are the ones running the place, and we are the ones swearing and crying our asses off over ridiculous little things. :D
(Btw, is there a way to find out why I got half a day forum ban? There is not even a rule that would give 1 day. If I did flame or something, either warn me (1st time) or give me my full 3 days, man! :) )
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I agree with you 1000% about that!
And for ban on forum, well you flamed out of flame room, and you were warned before!
So any time you flame on forum, or do something forbidden you will be banned cause you cant get any more warns!
Btw I did not banned you, I v only checked why u are banned!
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Anyone could applied for mod!
I did not seen yours or anyone else who is writing posts like yours application!
It is easy to accuse but is hard to take the job!
That has nothing to do with the topic. The question is about the admins' credibility or a certain admin's credibility. It's true that "working" as an admin on your site obviously takes a lot of time and effort if someone wants to do it well. But that's not a reason to screw up and going against the rules. Admins should be the role model for regular players. They shall never drink wine and preach water.
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Beast you are totally right, ,mods should be the role models. ATM the rules, mods and community dont correlate well with each other. For exp new season begins and people abuse this no gmes played to host noob games when they are pro. To help catch these offenders, mods can go undercover and ban these people. Now most mods are medium to pro range, by the definition. So now you have the people that get banned flame you because ur a pro in noob game and your not banned.
On topic with your issue, different mods have more of a vendetta against certain offenders. So they sometimes go over the written rules to punish the offender. New system will be coming out soon. With this new rules will be established, with many of these issues hopefully resolved.
There is no real answer to this. Always 2 sides of a story, so the only thing we can do is be patient with us
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Don't you mean low to medium skill polska?
If u disagree please name some mod better then medium skill besides Myubernick and Fawkz.
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Mr.niceguy. He is way above average skills.
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Mr.niceguy. He is way above average skills.
wow I just checked his last 3 pages - that's downright depressing. He might be a little better then average, but not way better.
Edit: I thought boramir's pottm was okay though - I just don't like the people who can play 2/3 heros and join -ap games to own solomid (bootlecrow) with their hero.
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i can just play ursa and nevemore :)
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and this woman with ice arrows (treaxeax) *
* solo mid ofc
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And does the trax Beyond Godlike build (©trollwarlord) involve agi treads, vanguard, HotD and butterfly? ;D ;D
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i can just play ursa and nevemore :)
Ah I can remember the Nevermore. But still, your nevermore >> mr.niceguy.
Haven't seen your Ursa, so no comment on that.
And does the trax Beyond Godlike build (©trollwarlord) involve agi treads, vanguard, HotD and butterfly? ;D ;D
Guy! Everyone knows the traxbuild for beyond godlike is Phase Hood lothar skadi
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Due to off-topic discussion this thread is locked.