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Strategy Discussion Section => DotA Discussion => Topic started by: cen on February 10, 2020, 19:34

Title: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: cen on February 10, 2020, 19:34
Survey
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 10, 2020, 19:49
The question is unclear.

Does enforcing balance means to type !balance before start or to not allow unbalanced games e.g. 20% vs 80%? If so which constraints?
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: cen on February 10, 2020, 19:54
Game cannot start without !balance command and any changes in slots reset that condition.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: AntlermanXXL on February 10, 2020, 20:20
I refuse! No fun deer games at all just for imaginary balance, which is never truth.

For me, this is just a proposal in order to satisfy players with poisoned mind
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Hamza on February 10, 2020, 20:37
I think it can be avoided by locking players
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: ilikedat on February 11, 2020, 13:51
Survey
if there wont be !balance command based on players stats and not based on their psr i dont think that is useful.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 11, 2020, 15:09
i want to point out that !balance doesnt always give fair balance. You can type it and get 60/40 and manually get 50/50
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: AntlermanXXL on February 11, 2020, 15:17
I want to just add my dramatic 'balance is irrelevant at all, it never was' line. I did.

Stay deer !

Related info from our deer friend Commy: http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?topic=172753.msg608674#msg608674
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 11, 2020, 15:28
Maybe give more psr for games with balance typed before start with no changes and less for normal games?
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: AntlermanXXL on February 11, 2020, 15:28
Maybe give more psr for games with balance typed before start with no changes and less for normal games?
I like
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: beastiary on February 11, 2020, 21:20
promote stacking
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: AntlermanXXL on February 12, 2020, 11:16
you could make unbalanced games excluded from the statistic, there for those who want to play with "friends" can keep playing.

imagine amounts of joined players (not befriended ones) in those lobbies, which games will be without stats affection
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: AntlermanXXL on February 12, 2020, 11:22
went offtopic
I am not surprised by any conclusions that came from incomplete observations
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: .SaLiH. on February 12, 2020, 13:01
I didnt want to post but whatever

Lets look at previous "top 20 ladder" players and imagine a game with 1700+ psr
borilla, kealthas, deynro, fatality, wutch, fairy, liie and you can add or change with bunch of others like bolt, troll, ayds, thror, pastmistake, greatwolf etc.

These are the so called top 20 players if I am right. Lets imagine a game with full of these players (95% it happens to be few of them in same game-lobby).
In sentinel team:
-borilla
-fataliy+wutch (cos they play together)
- (you can insert some random of those or whatever)
-greatwolf
-pastmistake
Scourge team:
-denyro
-fairy
-bolt
-kealthas
-insert some random

So, here is the question, is this game balanced even with 1700-1800+PSR players?
My answer is, No.

Because I personally, more or less know their play-style and what they are capable of. However, (this is the most important part) it is according to me, to my observation, to my perception.

Some of those players "strategy" might connect while at the same time might not. And here starts the real problem, current host of the game, wants to balance game according to "his imagination" by saying this player is good and this player is shit. But again, its according to "his opinion".

So lets go back to "why it is not balanced" question. If we continue with our example above, team sentinel will have 2 supports, midlaner, carry and offlaner. (borilla or fatality mid, wutch will play either support or any role he likes, wolf will play some yakiro or cm, pastmistake maybe phoenix idk)

meanwhile team scourge will have deynro mid, fairy spectre or something, bolt the mega hooker, kealthas tiny, and some random who will be forced to play support while he is going to get creeps or idk buy items instead of wards.

While team sentinel has few players with higher winrate, team scourge has maybe less. For this reason its possible to say its unbalanced. HOWEVER, this doesnt mean that scourge will lose 100% for obvious reasons idk if I have to say but whatever I will.
Sentinel can have miscommunications (or throw the game) and lose the game easily. These players have different knowledge whether they are 1800 or 2000+psr. This is the part where it comes to "psr-rank is just a number" or as mister Antlerman pointed "imaginary balance".  (I dont really wanna go further with examples, I could use tons of with so called "Professional DotA2 Players")

As a conclusion I would say, I just pointed maybe 1 or 2 things that show balance is  imaginary, meanwhile there are many points which can be added. If you want to change balance system do it as you please, however, just dont do anything related with "playing with friends" or with its stereotype word "stacking".
Thanks
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 12, 2020, 13:11
Thank you for presenting a great example, Salih. Would be indeed good if we had all games like that. However, most games contain 1 or 2 of those players you mentioned and the rest are nabs, so balance might not have the same impact you are fearing.

I agree that psr balance isn't always good, first of all you need to make psr more representative of skill. Just as said 1800 psr is same as 2000 just 2000 plays more games. But balance with them will be totally screwed
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Happy.. on February 12, 2020, 13:17
HOWEVER, this doesnt mean that scourge will lose 100% for obvious reasons idk if

What are you talking about? We would have stomped them easily  :hacker:
I challenge the mentioned Sentinel team with Grga as a sub for Bolt & just one decent supp that has at least 50% of the game knowledge as Whutch.

@bewater can match the mighty Wutcher anytime
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: jeandarc on February 12, 2020, 13:47
Every team needs a bright and intelligence team captain such as No_LifeR_xD to lead the team to victory by calmly explaining everyone's role and how to work together to become victorious even in the most dire straits. If only we could duplicate No_LifeR_xD's DNA and get another No_LifeR_xD so both teams can have one high skilled captain, I don't see any other way of balancing the games.

@nikolagay agree? :angel:
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Jimmy on February 12, 2020, 14:02
ArE YoU mOcKiNg OuR gOd ?
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Jimmy on February 12, 2020, 14:05
nO_LiFeR_Xd    after picking Mortred/Bloodseeker for the 100th time this week in a low rated PUB Game..
....
...
..
.

(https://en.meming.world/images/en/thumb/f/fd/I%27ll_Fuckin_Do_It_Again.jpg/300px-I%27ll_Fuckin_Do_It_Again.jpg)
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: nikolagay on February 12, 2020, 14:23
I love how the topic instantly switched to meme mode as soon as you mentioned nolifer.
(http://www.simpleimageresizer.com/_uploads/photos/8312f9ba/bf4_79.jpg)

Didn't have time to review the whole serious discussion but I honestly think my opinion won't matter regardless of what I have to say, so I'll just do my best no to spam the topic.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: jeandarc on February 12, 2020, 14:54
I mean it's pretty much impossible to have everyone satisfied with the balancing system. The problem arises when on one team there's a group of 2-5 players who want to play together (whether they do it to gain easy psr or just want to have fun playing together doesn't really matter) and on the other side there are 5 solo players. Even if both of these teams have the same average psr, the team that has a group of friends in it will win most of the games.
Now, the easy and the obvious solution would be to match the team with a group of players (be that 3+2, 4+1 or 5) who play together versus another team with a group of players (be that 3+2, 4+1 or 5), but the problem is that we don't have nearly as many players to achieve something like that.
Another "solution" could be reducing the psr gain by half to the players who are locked together, but this doesn't really solve the problem of improving the game quality.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: grga_man on February 12, 2020, 15:30
Quote

These are the so called top 20 players if I am
-borilla
-fataliy+wutch (cos they play together)
- (you can insert some random of those or whatever)
-greatwolf
-pastmistake
Scourge team:
-denyro
-fairy
-bolt
-kealthas
-insert some random


Can i be random one, this seems like role for me, or that slot is reserved for No_Lifer_xD?
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: ilikedat on February 13, 2020, 10:02
I mean it's pretty much impossible to have everyone satisfied with the balancing system. The problem arises when on one team there's a group of 2-5 players who want to play together (whether they do it to gain easy psr or just want to have fun playing together doesn't really matter) and on the other side there are 5 solo players. Even if both of these teams have the same average psr, the team that has a group of friends in it will win most of the games.
Now, the easy and the obvious solution would be to match the team with a group of players (be that 3+2, 4+1 or 5) who play together versus another team with a group of players (be that 3+2, 4+1 or 5), but the problem is that we don't have nearly as many players to achieve something like that.
Another "solution" could be reducing the psr gain by half to the players who are locked together, but this doesn't really solve the problem of improving the game quality.
if u see a locked team and u think they will win the game easy then u can allways leave no need to change psr system for everything.
i insist that something must be done to balance the game based on player stats (min 10-20 games) and to earn psr based on current player psr for example if u have 1600 u are going to win +6 and lose -5 untill u reach 1700+
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 13, 2020, 14:54
I wonder, is it possible to make that player could change his name color in the lobby?

Let's say the position
1 - blue
2 - green
3 - red
4 - yellow
5 - orange

Let's say I join ap game and type !color blue and my nick becomes blue, there for host/team knows that I'm going to play carry, or I don't feel like farming and type !color orange and my nick becomes orange.

If you have more colorful people with decided roles, you can split support players, carry players and therefor making a game more balanced.

Of course, you need to explain what roles are and what they do. It will take time until all players would get accustomed to this, but it would drastically improve game quality and balance.

p.s. it could be any other indication about role you want to play beside color.

Im not sure about text but it should possible to make actual NAMES colored within 1 game and assign the colors when you type !supp, !carry etc.

A suffix or affix could be added alternatively

Since this is offtopic to this thread, i will post your idea as suggestion (i hope you dont mind)
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: iErnesto94 on February 14, 2020, 00:38
BanReset the stats from the hosts that stack excessively in a daily basis and most of the problems will be fixed. I tried several times to restart playing but every single time the same 10 people stack their games in a ridiculous unplayable way.

PS: If you dont have enough people I could hellp to make the new rules and try to enforce them.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 14, 2020, 00:45
Where should friends play then? For example i play with friends often and we are noobs and always lose = stack too?

Quote
PS: If you dont have enough people I could hellp to make the new rules and try to enforce them.

I support
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Akuma on February 14, 2020, 00:55
I'm a no for this.

Balance is based on PSR, and PSR in many ways isn't a good decider about a quality of a player, but since its best we can get we rely on it.

If you enforce it it would probably mean, some good players entering smurf accounts just to play with their friends and this would make even more imbalanced games.

Also people tend to make friends they want to play with, 99% of my last games I played with mr. agent, mr. deer, mr. salih and rest of deer squad, I actually can't remember last time I played a game without any of above-mentioned in my team.
Sometimes we even had a full stack and we played for fun. Now tell me how much time would we spend if we tried to host a game with 5 stack (without locking) with full balance?
How many people would actually play against a full stack? Even though we are not playing seriously and we deer around, people have tendency not to want to play against a stack, so having a team of friends locked would mean they either wait hour to start a game or not start it at all. (There are also LAN people who simply need to play together for obvious reasons and imagine they make a team, I guess some MK-s are doing it still.)
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: ilikedat on February 14, 2020, 02:07
If it was a problem with the hosts are starting games without using !balance command then yeah i would say yes go ahead but there is no point if even after balance game its not balanced correctly.
@cen can u give a answer if can be done to make balance based on k/d ratio? I know even this suggestion have flaws but i still think is better than the current one. Just let me give u an example
http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252708
the game here is balanced in start but if u check players one by one u will find out that the sentinel had no chance to win the game,i mean in every game theres a chance but only if the picks are bad bcs they will allways get outplayed.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: cen on February 14, 2020, 09:43
Yes, it is technically possible if we agree it better represents the balance value.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Yerga on February 14, 2020, 09:53
I think you should had wrote the reason why you want to bring this system,if it's againsts stackers then you need to do something related with !lock command as well,locking 5 players in same team is making game 'balanced' by system since system doesn't swap locked players to down so game will be started without problems

Games won't likely to balanced ingame because Salih already explain with examples,most people in this server prefers to play carry and game can be dominated by from one side if they got decent heroes while other team has got 4-5 carry heroes in same team without teamplay in '%50 vs %50' balanced game

It's better to bring auto hosted games rather than letting player's host their own game rather than this system if you want to change games since host should have his rights to decide which players should be in his team,if players don't satisfy with host's 'balanced' game then they can leave lobby before 10 seconds and they got too have rights for host their own game

So i would had say this system no,also host can kick a player or other players leave from lobby whenever they don't want to play with any player so this system will likely to increase duration of lobby time and won't be effective much as you expected
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: UltimateTroll on February 14, 2020, 15:14
I didnt want to post but whatever

Lets look at previous "top 20 ladder" players and imagine a game with 1700+ psr
borilla, kealthas, deynro, fatality, wutch, fairy, liie and you can add or change with bunch of others like bolt, troll, ayds, thror, pastmistake, greatwolf etc.

These are the so called top 20 players if I am right. Lets imagine a game with full of these players (95% it happens to be few of them in same game-lobby).
In sentinel team:
-borilla
-fataliy+wutch (cos they play together)
- (you can insert some random of those or whatever)
-greatwolf
-pastmistake
Scourge team:
-denyro
-fairy
-bolt
-kealthas
-insert some random

So, here is the question, is this game balanced even with 1700-1800+PSR players?
My answer is, No.

Because I personally, more or less know their play-style and what they are capable of. However, (this is the most important part) it is according to me, to my observation, to my perception.

Some of those players "strategy" might connect while at the same time might not. And here starts the real problem, current host of the game, wants to balance game according to "his imagination" by saying this player is good and this player is shit. But again, its according to "his opinion".

So lets go back to "why it is not balanced" question. If we continue with our example above, team sentinel will have 2 supports, midlaner, carry and offlaner. (borilla or fatality mid, wutch will play either support or any role he likes, wolf will play some yakiro or cm, pastmistake maybe phoenix idk)

meanwhile team scourge will have deynro mid, fairy spectre or something, bolt the mega hooker, kealthas tiny, and some random who will be forced to play support while he is going to get creeps or idk buy items instead of wards.

While team sentinel has few players with higher winrate, team scourge has maybe less. For this reason its possible to say its unbalanced. HOWEVER, this doesnt mean that scourge will lose 100% for obvious reasons idk if I have to say but whatever I will.
Sentinel can have miscommunications (or throw the game) and lose the game easily. These players have different knowledge whether they are 1800 or 2000+psr. This is the part where it comes to "psr-rank is just a number" or as mister Antlerman pointed "imaginary balance".  (I dont really wanna go further with examples, I could use tons of with so called "Professional DotA2 Players")

As a conclusion I would say, I just pointed maybe 1 or 2 things that show balance is  imaginary, meanwhile there are many points which can be added. If you want to change balance system do it as you please, however, just dont do anything related with "playing with friends" or with its stereotype word "stacking".
Thanks
Im impressed somebody is actually aware of the whole picture here,i couldnt have said it better myself.Its beyond me that some of those players u named who are pretty good individually still lack knowledge about the game basics.If u were to ask some of them what are the positions,1 to 5,most of them would have no clue .
Btw,i dont appreciate being in the same sentence with bolt,ayd masters and pastmistake even tho im not that active 😁
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: iErnesto94 on February 14, 2020, 20:15
Locking 4  pro friends with you is not considered stacker host. However, when i have 14/3/12 k/d/a and I dont know the host but he still locks me with him thats considered stacking.

I had an account with 15/4/12 and 50% of the games I was locked top without knowing the host , or swapped top after the balance. At least this kind of behavior from people that do it daily should be punished.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 14, 2020, 20:36
Locking 4  pro friends with you is not considered stacker host. However, when i have 14/3/12 k/d/a and I dont know the host but he still locks me with him thats considered stacking.

I had an account with 15/4/12 and 50% of the games I was locked top without knowing the host , or swapped top after the balance. At least this kind of behavior from people that do it daily should be punished.

I agree, maybe option should be added to allow yourself to be locked, like host types !lock you but you are only locked if you write !allowlock or something like that.

Adding rule to prevent stacking like this would be good too
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Akuma on February 14, 2020, 20:54
Guys you are overcomplicating things, while its as simple as: Host your own game and play the way you like.

If you don't like playing with stack or against stack - don't play such game.

About these people you described who stack with "randoms" just to win and get psr, I sincerely pity them, but I don't find a valid reason for "enforcing them" not to play in such way.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: iErnesto94 on February 14, 2020, 21:25
    The behavior below is the sort of thing that I think should not be allowed. I included a very small amount of this player's stacking behavior because this process is time consuming.
    In my opinion there are 10-15 players that have the same kind of behavior that have forced hundreds of players to leave the server.
    In the past the players had the option to leave the lobby but now when there are only 1-2 games in the lobby you either will have to wait 30-60min to join other lobby or be forced to play these joke games. These hosts take advantage of the small amount of games in the lobby.
Thus suggestions as the one below are not applicable most of the time. Hosting a new game when there are 50-60 players online during many hours of the day is not possible.
Quote
Guys you are overcomplicating things, while its as simple as: Host your own game and play the way you like.



No locks in the top team were added in case some of them were friends, even though often he locks good players top that he doesnt even know.
http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252945
02:42   TooShade   !balance
02:46   TooShade   !sp
02:56   TooShade   !Lock tes        (locked feeder bot)
02:57   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u (spam to hide stacking)
03:10   TooShade   !Lock pal (locked feeder bot)
03:10   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u (spam to hide stacking)
04:56   TooShade   !Lock java (locked feeder bot)
04:56   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u (spam to hide stacking)


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252624
00:23   TooShade   !balance
00:51   TooShade   !Lock dark (locked feeder bot)
00:52   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:10   TooShade   !Balance
01:16   TooShade   !Lock cd(locked feeder bot)
01:16   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:53   TooShade   !balance
01:56   TooShade   !lock more(locked feeder bot)
01:56   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
.......... and the stacking continues


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252545
06:44   TooShade   !Lock dav(locked feeder bot)
06:44   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:37   TooShade   !Lock gom(locked feeder bot)
08:37   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:47   TooShade   !Lock 3az(locked feeder bot)
08:47   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:53      3az3az has left the game.
09:37   TooShade   !Lock 3az(locked feeder bot)
09:37   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
09:55   TooShade   !Lock 01(locked feeder bot)
09:55   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
.......... and the stacking continues


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251259
01:46   TooShade   !lock sco(locked feeder bot)
01:46   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:49   TooShade   !Lock si(locked feeder bot)
01:49   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)



http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251075
04:22      [pietruch] PSR: 1548 games: 1158 W/L: 3/0
04:22      H. K/D/A 1.33/5.33/8.67 C. K/D/N 222.67/5.67/141.67
04:24   TooShade   !Lock pie (Lock feeder player bot)


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251051
02:25      [nihal_kotar] PSR: 1440 games: 781 W/L: 14/16
02:25      H. K/D/A 4.53/9.00/12.90 C. K/D/N 84.13/3.43/22.63
02:30   TooShade   !lock kot(locked feeder bot)
02:30   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
05:03   TooShade   !Lock salo(locked feeder bot)
05:03   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
06:08   TooShade   !Lock giub(locked feeder bot)
06:08   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
06:37   TooShade   !lock has(locked feeder bot)
06:37   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)



http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251874
01:46   TooShade   !Lock ras(locked feeder bot)
01:46   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
06:42   TooShade   !Lock dra(locked feeder bot)
06:42   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:42   TooShade   !Lock iron(locked feeder bot)
08:42   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)



http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6250002
01:06   TooShade   !Lock moz(locked feeder bot)
01:06   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:30   TooShade   !lock -[ (locked feeder bot)
01:30   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:54   TooShade   !swap 4 8
01:54   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u
01:57   TooShade   !Lock _sk(locked feeder bot)
01:57   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)


I strongly believe that action should be taken to stop those few players that are stacking excessively.

Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Akuma on February 14, 2020, 21:50
Yeah this makes him pathetic and we already realized this in some other topic, He should get banned for spamming especially since its in purpose of "deceiving". But as a host he is allowed to do any lockings, and players are free to leave the game if they don't like it.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: iErnesto94 on February 14, 2020, 21:57
Yeah this makes him pathetic and we already realized this in some other topic, He should get banned for spamming especially since its in purpose of "deceiving". But as a host he is allowed to do any lockings, and players are free to leave the game if they don't like it.

We all know that currently the host can lock and do as you want. For this reason I suggested to change the rules so that excessive stacking wouldnt be allowed.

Things and circumstances change. In the past you could leave the lobby and join an other lobby or host your own game. Now, especially during after 2 server time this is not possible due to lack of players. You either stay and tolerate this pathetic lobby or leave and waitr 30-60min for the next game or go to sleep. The stacking hosts know that and abuse it!
Seeveral times I told to some host politely please dont stack and the response was to kick me and laugh with the fact that now I had to go offline since there was no other game to join and hosting pointless since already the 30 online players are ingame.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Akuma on February 14, 2020, 22:08
Yeah this makes him pathetic and we already realized this in some other topic, He should get banned for spamming especially since its in purpose of "deceiving". But as a host he is allowed to do any lockings, and players are free to leave the game if they don't like it.

We all know that currently the host can lock and do as you want. For this reason I suggested to change the rules so that excessive stacking wouldnt be allowed.

Things and circumstances change. In the past you could leave the lobby and join an other lobby or host your own game. Now, especially during after 2 server time this is not possible due to lack of players. You either stay and tolerate this pathetic lobby or leave and waitr 30-60min for the next game or go to sleep. The stacking hosts know that and abuse it!
Seeveral times I told to some host politely please dont stack and the response was to kick me and laugh with the fact that now I had to go offline since there was no other game to join and hosting pointless since already the 30 online players are ingame.

Do you have any more examples of people doing this, or is it just this guy a 'problematic one' (stacking low stats bottom, random good stats top).
Because if its just one guy doing this, it can easily be solved without need to do any major changes.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Happy.. on February 14, 2020, 23:26

http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252945
02:42   TooShade   !balance
02:46   TooShade   !sp
02:56   TooShade   !Lock tes        (locked feeder bot)
02:57   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u (spam to hide stacking)
03:10   TooShade   !Lock pal (locked feeder bot)
03:10   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u (spam to hide stacking)
04:56   TooShade   !Lock java (locked feeder bot)
04:56   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u (spam to hide stacking)


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252624
00:23   TooShade   !balance
00:51   TooShade   !Lock dark (locked feeder bot)
00:52   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:10   TooShade   !Balance
01:16   TooShade   !Lock cd(locked feeder bot)
01:16   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:53   TooShade   !balance
01:56   TooShade   !lock more(locked feeder bot)
01:56   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
.......... and the stacking continues


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6252545
06:44   TooShade   !Lock dav(locked feeder bot)
06:44   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:37   TooShade   !Lock gom(locked feeder bot)
08:37   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:47   TooShade   !Lock 3az(locked feeder bot)
08:47   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:53      3az3az has left the game.
09:37   TooShade   !Lock 3az(locked feeder bot)
09:37   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
09:55   TooShade   !Lock 01(locked feeder bot)
09:55   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
.......... and the stacking continues


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251259
01:46   TooShade   !lock sco(locked feeder bot)
01:46   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:49   TooShade   !Lock si(locked feeder bot)
01:49   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)



http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251075
04:22      [pietruch] PSR: 1548 games: 1158 W/L: 3/0
04:22      H. K/D/A 1.33/5.33/8.67 C. K/D/N 222.67/5.67/141.67
04:24   TooShade   !Lock pie (Lock feeder player bot)


http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251051
02:25      [nihal_kotar] PSR: 1440 games: 781 W/L: 14/16
02:25      H. K/D/A 4.53/9.00/12.90 C. K/D/N 84.13/3.43/22.63
02:30   TooShade   !lock kot(locked feeder bot)
02:30   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
05:03   TooShade   !Lock salo(locked feeder bot)
05:03   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
06:08   TooShade   !Lock giub(locked feeder bot)
06:08   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
06:37   TooShade   !lock has(locked feeder bot)
06:37   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)



http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6251874
01:46   TooShade   !Lock ras(locked feeder bot)
01:46   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
06:42   TooShade   !Lock dra(locked feeder bot)
06:42   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
08:42   TooShade   !Lock iron(locked feeder bot)
08:42   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)



http://dota.eurobattle.net/la/forum/index.php?action=gameinfo;sa=game;gid=6250002
01:06   TooShade   !Lock moz(locked feeder bot)
01:06   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:30   TooShade   !lock -[ (locked feeder bot)
01:30   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)
01:54   TooShade   !swap 4 8
01:54   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u
01:57   TooShade   !Lock _sk(locked feeder bot)
01:57   TooShade   !hold f u c k . y o u f u c k . y o u(spam to hide stacking)


This is pure gold.
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: UltimateTroll on February 14, 2020, 23:41
If uve only seen stuff like this thanks to ernestos post,u gotta be one of those guys who just enter a lobby and afk it til the moment ure kicked/game started.Started with the popular mk stackers few years back if i recall,even they dont do that anymore tho
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 15, 2020, 00:27
If uve only seen stuff like this thanks to ernestos post,u gotta be one of those guys who just enter a lobby and afk it til the moment ure kicked/game started.Started with the popular mk stackers few years back if i recall,even they dont do that anymore tho

I always go afk while waiting in lobby, maybe its because waiting is usually 30 minutes, so many watch youtube while waiting
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: jeandarc on February 15, 2020, 01:39
I always make love to my beautiful hot model girlfriend when waiting for the strumica boys to start the game
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Deynro on February 15, 2020, 05:33
All you have to do is to remove the kda/stats system and all problems, dramas etc are solved. It's that simple!

Take notes! MONGOLOIDS!
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: luke on February 15, 2020, 21:28
All you have to do is to remove the kda/stats system and all problems, dramas etc are solved. It's that simple!

Take notes! MONGOLOIDS!

Maybe its the right thing to do. Hard to play support on this server, because everyone !sd you and says "WOW, what a noob 5/7 SD, kick or !ignore"
Title: Re: Enforce balance before game start
Post by: Happy.. on February 16, 2020, 18:44
Just remove that cancerous K/D/A already. Leave the points and winrate.