Another ban mod on a power trip

[iNK]

A little bit off topic, sorry, but i never understood why leaving before creep spawning is not bannable? It is just as irritating as any other type of leaving, and it also wastes a lot of time for the other players.

It is mostly about intent, why would a person want to ruin a game that early? Besides noobs not liking their hero, which is bannable. Like it is said above the rules, bans are mainly mods decision. If a mod for example were to see someone leave because of this, I am sure that person would be banned.

[AliRadicali]

A little bit off topic, sorry, but i never understood why leaving before creep spawning is not bannable? It is just as irritating as any other type of leaving, and it also wastes a lot of time for the other players.

THIS.

Since you cannot know the circumstances of someone leaving, least of all based on the time of leaving, it seems rather trivial and pointless to punish leaving early less severely than leaving late.

Furthermore, an early leaver is arguably even more annoying than someone who ragequits halfway through.
When someone leaves @ minute 1, you're pretty much forced to remake. When someone leaves after receiving a thorough thumping, his continued presence usually wouldn't have affected the outcome of the game anyway.

TL;DR: Leaving during loading or before creepspawn should be worth a tempban too. If someone feels he has been wrongfully dealt with, he can always try to explain the circumstances of his leave in the unban forum (like night should have done, hint hint).

[iNK]

I beg to differ, I would much likely have a person leave in min 1, in a that has not gained  any value to me, than to have a leaver ruin the game mid way through. It can go both ways, if you feel a person wrongfully left the game you could always post ban request...

[night_must_fall]

Wow , i see this now . 6 pages . im honored 
I see that this discussion has grown into smth different .
Pls dont take me the wrong way , i dont think anyone of you is stupid, but what is not clear here
1. That i had a disc during loading
2. That the host banned me for that even though everything implies that it was a disc, or at least that it wasnt a voluntarily left case
3. That it was a rage ban , which is visible
4. That i came back , entered the lobby and asked him why did he banned me( some persons here think that is not polite enough wtf) , which he didnt deserve , in fact if i was reviewing another request he would be banned for ban abuse
5. That he states that i abused my mod status by unbannig myself (fgs are u that blind , do u really think i would be a mod and deal with who knows with how many requests , that i cant unban myself , are you,  i must say stupid , that if i wasnt worthy of that status and the power to unban/ban users (including myself) would ever been given that right?).
6. I see u dont read the posts , our head mod has given u an explanation that a 10year old could understand and u still point the same thing over and over , and u tell me i insult smn by saying the word stupid??
I will not post here anymore , i dont know why i did in the first place. I see only new users posting here, and i showed them the respect in answering , now i see even too much, which as i can see dont understand a simple concept . Those with higher credibility and status here have given their opinion , and its very clear.

 

[fnelleh]

It's like talking to a wall, except the wall would have a much higher IQ.

[AliRadicali]

I beg to differ, I would much likely have a person leave in min 1, in a that has not gained  any value to me, than to have a leaver ruin the game mid way through. It can go both ways, if you feel a person wrongfully left the game you could always post ban request...

What would you rather have: Honest gamers having to go through a lot of effort to ban leavers, or leavers that have to go through some effort if they were punished more severely that they think they should have?

Leaving, even if there are mitigating circumstances, is still ruining a game for 9 others. Creating an unban request is the least amount of penance you should be forced to do in such a case.

Leaving, and then getting off free because no-one can be arsed to get you banned warned (or no one knows how) is a lot more harmful IMO than forcing the occasional lagger to get on this forum and ask for an unban.


TL;DR: if you guys are serious about trying to accommodate mitigating circumstances, then have the default penalty be a tempban, regardless of when someone leaves, and then publish a list of allowed "excuses" that allow you to request an unban (I.E.: I disced, I got a bluescreen, I got a fatal error, my dog ate my router, an airplane crashed into the power station, etc.).


I get the feeling even a subterranean wall in a goth's coal cellar would be brighter than this one.

[Geistesblitz]

This is a little hard to believe, I went away for a couple of hours and 6 pages on a thread like this.

Here is how it works.

Game owners starting games does not mean that they get power and that they can play a game. Being a game owner also means you're responsible for that game.

Game owner is responsible for the stability of the game.

It is the game owner's responsibility to check player pings before starting and decide if he will kick any high pings or not.

Abusing ban command is not allowed.
Banning people without a valid reason is bad hosting; (like banning player who had good score and got disconnected)
Let me explain to you why it is considered abuse to ban someone that disconnects during the loading screen.
Leaving (before creeps spawn) Warn

We also have this: NOTES: Following ban codex is not obligatory! It is mainly moderator’s decision.


Bad host   12 hours - 2 weeks 1 - 9 warns


Can you find -ONE- reason for he to plug during the loading screen?

If your whole scandal was about letting us know that he unbanned himself, then you've failed. We can determine when a moderator unbans himself. It's all logged. If you still really wanted to point it out then you should have contacted MrNiceGuy or someone above him directly. Not create this post which only shows how you don't understand how the rules work.

Remember it's easier to get closer to what you want being polite than being rude.

If you needed someone to explain you the situation I would have gladly, and even more, if night_must_fall had been at fault; I'd have done something about it, friend or not. Don't believe me? Asks all my friends that I've banned.


Looks quite simple for me. Rage aside, why is it so difficult to understand?

[AliRadicali]

This is a little hard to believe, I went away for a couple of hours and 6 pages on a thread like this.

Here is how it works.

Game owners starting games does not mean that they get power and that they can play a game. Being a game owner also means you're responsible for that game.

Game owner is responsible for the stability of the game.

It is the game owner's responsibility to check player pings before starting and decide if he will kick any high pings or not.

Thank you captain condescending. I'm 99.9% sure that NEGERTIVS did !p100 at least once before starting the game, since he always does so. Is there anything more he can do? Should he contact night_must_fail's internet provider before starting? Stop trying to blame night's disconnect on NEGERTIVS, it's downright preposterous.

Abusing ban command is not allowed.

The list of rules does not specifically state that leaving before creepspawn is not a bannable offense (which is a ridiculous rule by the way, see above^). You need to check the list of ban durations to know that you're not allowed to ban people who leave early on.
In short, it's ridiculous to assume that every single host knew about this exception to the rules, especially since it is a relatively recent change. You cannot blame NEGERTIVS for not knowing about this weird and trivial exception, especially since the bot simply allows you to ban leavers as per normal in the first few minutes.

Banning people without a valid reason is bad hosting; (like banning player who had good score and got disconnected)

Why the f#ck does everyone act like disconnecting is not worth a ban? NOWHERE do the rules state this, and while an unintentional leave is a mitigating circumstance, it is still breaking the rules.
It makes perfect sense to me to ban laggers, since the last thing you want for them is to ruin more games with their shitty net conn, and you cannot even be sure if it's a true disc or an intentional plug.

Can you find -ONE- reason for he to plug during the loading screen?

It DOESN'T MATTER if it's a plug or a disc. It is IRRELEVANT. Leaving is not allowed on this server and nowhere do the rules state that disconnecting is not leaving.

If your whole scandal was about letting us know that he unbanned himself, then you've failed. We can determine when a moderator unbans himself. It's all logged.

But since the mods all got each others' backs, that wouldn't have achieved anything now would it? At least this way the rest of the forum gets to see the mods acting like smarmy condescending douches when confronted with a valid complaint and a few very valid concerns with the current rule set. (Inb4 "OMG rule change. That doesn't really help if you don't tell us how this change will affect the rules in question.)

Remember it's easier to get closer to what you want being polite than being rude.

Bro, what thread have you been reading? The ones being downright rude here are certain mods.

[yaphets_]

lol this is a long thread how long will take to be resolved 

[night_must_fall]

Lol ALiradicali , i dont know to who did mrniceguy recommended medical treatment but i recommend it to you. MAn ur beyond commenting , and your posts are ridiculous at best. You dont have of clue to what your saying, u dont understand what half of the community is trying to say to you, and i repeat a 10year old could understand , so pls stop making yourself an ingnorant , introduce urself with our rules and the way things work , u give urself too much credibility. I wont post to this idiotic topic . Cheers

[NEGERTIVS]

Ali gave his view on some of the reasoning in Geistesblitz' post. Your reply to this was basically "omg joo nid medical treatment u post retarded bla bla", like a thirteen in a dozen pubtard. You are a mod, you can not reply like this. If you do not have anything to contribute to a topic or discussion, then kindly sod off. Thanks!

Oh and the same should go for you mrniceguy, recommending someone who has just proven you wrong with actual arguments for "medical treatment" is a response entirely unappropriate for a mod. God Ive never seen so much flaming done by mods. By your own rules you should be banned from your own forum, lmao!

ON TOPIC NOW:

I am ofcourse willing to concede that I did not notice that a player who leaves before the creeps spawn apparently only deserves a warn. It's only a tiny footnote and a mere technicality which gets him off the hook then. He has still not received a warn. And didnt open an unban request to have this warn and/or ban removed. Oh and might I add that that rule just sounds downright retarded.

So then remains the n'th unanswered issue, namely his power abuse. I think it's a shame that when I start a thread and state a bunch of actual issues, it actually takes four pages of offtopic flaming by the mods before Zerind, who is not even a mod, produces an actual contribution to the discussion. Perhaps he should be promoted? All in all this does not make the mods look good, and in the end you have only yourselves to blame for that.

[AliRadicali]

Lol ALiradicali , i dont know to who did mrniceguy recommended medical treatment but i recommend it to you. MAn ur beyond commenting , and your posts are ridiculous at best. You dont have of clue to what your saying, u dont understand what half of the community is trying to say to you, and i repeat a 10year old could understand , so pls stop making yourself an ingnorant , introduce urself with our rules and the way things work , u give urself too much credibility. I wont post to this idiotic topic . Cheers

I find it ironic that someone who responds to arguments with petty insults tries to talk about credibility.
Please come back when you learn how to reply to an argument with counter-arguments rather than mud-slinging and off-topic rambling.

[mrNiceguy]

Oh and the same should go for you mrniceguy, recommending someone who has just proven you wrong with actual arguments for "medical treatment" is a response entirely unappropriate for a mod. God Ive never seen so much flaming done by mods. By your own rules you should be banned from your own forum, lmao!

Point is HE DID NOT PROVEN ME WRONG, cause I was repeating you in 3 or 4 posts that he did not abused any power, and I gave you logical explanation for that!

But nooooo, you only understand what you want to understand, and above all your ban reasons are interesting too (confucionsm and something like that, that reasons you wrote when you ban someone one), so if you think you are inteligent enough to give that reasons when you ban someone, how come u dont get that he did not, I repeat did not abused his mod powers!

As I said before I would ban you myself cause you banned someone without knowing did he left on purpose or he lost connection by accident!

Also it is funny cause you and that guy witch need medical attention have same IP address!

So I dont know who is funny or dumb, but at least I am typing from this account and dont use any other account to confirm or to support my post!

About flame, it is not flame when you say someone that he needs medical attention, it is advise!

So now you can type as much as you wont and argue as much as you wont for me this is concluded:

You said he abused his mod position I have said he did not!

GG NO RE!

[[Shady] Polska]

NEGERTIVS you are right on mods should not down talk to anyone. Especially when your a authority figure. On the behalf excuse the insults.

On your topic about mod abuse, it can be looked at in any way. The reason your not getting a straight answer is because we do not feel the need to post for a unban request when we can do it ourselves. We do moderate in game and on forums, so it wouldn't  make sense for the mods to wait to get unbanned. If you feel that the mod abused his power contact the chain of command you have head unban/ ban mod GM and Admins.

On another note, please do not forget that I at least talk for myself can get very aggravated at pubbers telling us what to do. I have said this once, and I am not trying to repeat myself, but this server is ours. It is nothing something people have given us it is something we have given you. If it came down to it we would take away the ability for random pubbers to host on our ladder. We can close it, but we do not wish to do this. We enjoying giving back to the community, and enjoy most of the people here. But what aggravates us the most is when people feel the need to try to prove there point, and think they will gain something out of this. If fawkz or mun banned everyone for a day, what are you going to say?? Admin abuse?? Its theirs to do as they please. So where is this 6 page argument going. The answer is no Night powers are going to stay like it or not. Ruling stands. Is this the answer you are looking for?

If this does not clear the situation up, then I really do not understand where you are coming from.

[fnelleh]

Point is HE DID NOT PROVEN ME WRONG, cause I was repeating you in 3 or 4 posts that he did not abused any power, and I gave you logical explanation for that!

But nooooo, you only understand what you want to understand, and above all your ban reasons are interesting too (confucionsm and something like that, that reasons you wrote when you ban someone one), so if you think you are inteligent enough to give that reasons when you ban someone, how come u dont get that he did not, I repeat did not abused his mod powers!

As I said before I would ban you myself cause you banned someone without knowing did he left on purpose or he lost connection by accident!

Also it is funny cause you and that guy witch need medical attention have same IP address!

So I dont know who is funny or dumb, but at least I am typing from this account and dont use any other account to confirm or to support my post!

About flame, it is not flame when you say someone that he needs medical attention, it is advise!

So now you can type as much as you wont and argue as much as you wont for me this is concluded:

You said he abused his mod position I have said he did not!

GG NO RE!

What did you say about rage? Hypocrite much?

Anyway, two things:
1: I am NEGERTIVS brother, not NEGERTIVS himself. This, however, is completely irrelevant (trying to find excuses in anxiety?). Please make sure your two braincells are in touch otherwise things might get screwed up.
2: I was not the one advised to seek medical attention.

Besides the fact that you remain flaming and giving admins a bad name, your own facts are abominably wrong.
Maybe some admins in here should get a crash course in correctness and politeness (among other things).