Author Topic: Losing game 3v5  (Read 436 times)

Offline territory23

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Losing game 3v5
« on: February 12, 2019, 20:36 »
When 2 of your team leave because they are 3 years old, because they are noob, because they think if you lose early game you lose the game etc. autoban will be off and others leave as well.

In that situation you automatically count as losing the game and you lost PSR.

Does it make sense?

Why should I lose PSR because I have leavers in my team?

Should not it be a draw?

Offline Deynro

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2019, 20:55 »
Game is considered a draw and autoban is switched off  in the following situations:
4vs5 in the first 5 minutes
3vs5 in the first 15 minutes
      Note: In the 3vs5 after 15 minutes situation autoban will be switched off but the stats will be recorded!
      Note: You are strongly advised to use the !autoban command in order to check whether you can safely leave.
      Note: Every time a player leaves the game before end, he may lose PSR points even when autoban is off.
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Offline territory23

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2019, 22:38 »
Thank you, but I know the draw rules.

It was 23rd minute and we got 3 leavers. The rules force me to keep playing and lose game. If I stay AFK, I will be kicked. If my teammate does not go FF, then I need to keep dying, right?

Or the rules say, we can win 2v5? 

In my opinion, there should be draw if 2 leaves in same team, no matter what minute it is. Because the players which prefer to stay in game has no chance but lose.

Offline Deynro

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2019, 22:43 »
This is your perspective, in my perspective, sometimes it's a huge benefit when someone in your team leave after min 15, you can get their items and carry the game. I won so many games thanks to that.
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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2019, 23:38 »
I would love if those 4 peasants who I get into team with left at start, I would rape alone with their gold and my skill. Learn dota territory23.

Offline Astaroth

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2019, 07:26 »
If you had 3 leavers in 23rd min, the autoban went off.

So nobody forced you to keep playing.

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Offline territory23

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2019, 08:17 »
It is not about autoban. If you leave because you do not want to play 2v5 game, you lose PSR and it is not your fault.

On the other hand, I truly respect who says "give me an extra 15k gold and I will win 1v5".

I do not believe everybody should play above average level.

Offline Astaroth

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2019, 09:01 »
Of course you lose PSR. Why would anyone be "rewarded" (even by +0) for leaving? What else would you expect to get for leaving the game?

Or, let me put it another way, why would you punish the other team by not giving them PSR they deserve?

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Offline territory23

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2019, 11:17 »
Ok lets check draw rules again.

4vs5 in the first 5 minutes
3vs5 in the first 15 minutes

I am thinking this as the "winner" team. If we do not to punish them why it is considered as "draw" in first 5 mins or 15 mins? I guess it is about balance, then I can say it "should be" about balance after 23 minutes.

If we say playing 4v5 or 3v5 game after 5-15 mins makes no sense, then what is the difference of leaving game in 15 minutes and 23 minutes?

Why do we think if someone leaves before 5 minutes that affects balance and leaving in 23rd minute does not?

It about point of view. I believe we need to protect all players (except for first 2 leavers) rights. That is why I suggest a draw. 
« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 11:22 by territory23 »

Offline div.ide

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2019, 13:31 »
Not really, because whenever ally abandons, it's because they're noob and they're dragging you down, but if the enemy leaves, it's because i r so pro n i rekt de nub so he leave. Take back their "well earned" points and someone will come to complain about it, guaranteed.

Assuming yourself a keeper, look at it like this. There's 9 other players in game with you, 5 (five) of them being your enemies, and each of them is about as likely to turn out a gameruiner. Five out of nine times, leavers will be on enemy side. Five out of nine times, this benefits you. Forcing fraw on all games with leavers will screw you out of gaining ranking points more often than it will protect you from losses. Besides, automatically drawing the game anytime someone leaves would at best leave easily exploitable loophole for PSR grinding (if few people do it), at worst completely paralyze the ladder (if everyone joins the bandwagon). Think about it.

Anyway, you ask "Why do we think if someone leaves before 5 minutes that affects balance and leaving in 23rd minute does not?". We don't, leavers always affect game balance. However, you're asking wrong question.

The question you should be asking is  "Should leaving at 5 min mark be handled differently than leaving at 23 min mark, and why?"

Yes. It should. Here's why: leaving during different stages of game happens for different reasons, and affects game in different ways.

Early leavers are preemptive leavers. They will typically have severe attitude problems or leave after starting the game exceptionally poorly, either way affecting others before they could do anything about it. This has little to nothing to do with other players. It also happens before anything about the game was decided yet. For those reason it's only fair to only penalize the leaver and call it a draw for other players.

Mid- to lategame leavers are responsive leavers. They quit because of what already transpired, and then can't handle dealing with things not going in their favor. This has everything to do with other players, as they are co-authors of the situaiton that led to leaving in the first place. Ignoring that would be unfair, which is why game is scored normally for everyone else. Moreover, the later the abandon, the more contribution it leaves behind, and the more likely that at the time game was already going in other team's favor (if not effectively decided). You can't just erase the history.
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Offline begin

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2019, 14:00 »
On few other platforms there is never draw no matter if someone leaves in picking phase, no matter if 9 players leave, the game goes on and everyone should do their best. Also in life people should do their best. It is because dota is life. 8)

Offline _xpam_

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Re: Losing game 3v5
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2019, 04:59 »
This is your perspective, in my perspective, sometimes it's a huge benefit when someone in your team leave after min 15, you can get their items and carry the game. I won so many games thanks to that.

really  ;D when u became pro xD